Newsflash, Newfoundland is not the friendliest place in the world by a long shot!!!

Mar 20 2012

The notion that this place is a friendly one is false. I was told before I came to Newfoundland that I would meet loads of people and that the locals here were warm hearted and welcoming. That has to be the biggest misconception I have ever had about anything.
I moved here from Chicago. I lived there for five years. Prior to that I grew up in Halifax and have lived in multiple other places in my 30 odd years including Toronto, BC, NYC, Cincinnati to name a few. Out of all those experiences, this place is undoubtedly the most difficult place to make friends, which has never been a problem for me. I am well educated, funny, approachable and not ugly. My breath is not bad, I dress well yet locals do not interact with me at any level in social situations despite my subtle witty efforts.
For a while this was a mystery to me but I think I get it now. There is an assumption that all outsiders are either here for only a short period or are simply strange for wanting to be here. I am not strange and I am going to be here for a while unless I am driven away by simple solitude.
As this province continues to flourish, it is going to continue to attract individuals from outside that actually like being here. Yes, I said it, I actually like being here. I do not know why that is so outlandish when the people here claim to love their city and province so much, why would it be strange for someone not from here to find value in being here?!? The people of this island have to start opening their minds to making friends with people they haven’t known for generations.
Last Saturday I went out. I was with two other friends, both from away. We spoke to a total of 6 strangers, all of whom were also from away. The common thread of those conversations was how cold the locals were to people they didn’t know and how difficult it was to meet new people in this city.
When I first moved to Chicago I thought at some point I might get shot and that the Americans were ignorant, unfriendly people. That was the complete opposite of the experience I enjoyed while there. I met a ton of friends, some of whom I will be close with until I die. I came here expecting that I would be overwhelmed by the friendly locals and yet again I am shocked with the opposite reality. This time, I am not as pleased with the outcome. St. John’s I implore you, snap out of it.

Rant by People here suck

135 responses so far

  1. As someone who has come from away (USA) I heartily agree…this is exactly why I am leaving.

  2. There are stuck up people, assholes, angels and saints here just like anywhere.
    I pride myself on being friendly, and overly nice to strangers. But if Im in a bar with my friends and a guy hits on me, Im not the nicest.
    Where are you trying to meet these people?
    You cant just go out and think your going to make life long friends at a book store, or downtown. Join a group, Im sure you have made friends at work. Theres no way you havnt met any nice locals.
    Where are you living? The smaller cities outside of St Johns are way friendlier. I grew up in a small town and everybody smiles when theyre walking on the road, you could be in your window and walkers would nod or wave. I moved to town, and nobody says hello or anything on the street.
    Good luck with it all, there are so many great people here. I hope you find them

  3. IF FLAVOR FLAV HYPE MAN AND FLAVOR FLAV SAY DON’T BELIEVE HYPE, SHOULD HULK BELIEVE FLAVOR FLAV???

  4. St. John’s is not all of Newfoundland & Labrador. Get out of town, and away from the townies. That said, in some communities people will welcome you with open arms and invite you home for supper, and in others you’re likely to end in a fight at the local bar just for looking ‘different’. Sometimes you’ll get both in the same town. First, maybe, if you’re expecting to be overwhelmed by the ‘friendly locals’, you should examine your own expectations first. The worst kind of tourist is one who feels entitled to their preconceived notion of how ‘the other’ should be. This is our home. You are a guest. And you are welcome here. Perhaps, in time, it could be your home too. But, let’s say I was at your house in Chicago and I said, “Hey, I heard you like sausage and deep dish pizza here- how about you go into the kitchen and whip me up some?” It’s not culture on demand because you feel you deserve it or paid the airfare. It’s give and take with real people.

  5. Yeah, I came here with the same idea too. And then I woke up and realised that people in Newfoundland are people, and if I was going to believe some quaint mainlander or NL tourism stereotype about their supernatural friendliness then I was just going to imagine them all as extra bitter and cold. Get over it. They aren’t going to throw themselves at you.

  6. St. John’s != Newfoundland.
    i shouldn’t assume you haven’t been outside the city.
    i can say the rural experience is entirely different, but i can’t say if it would better or worse for your subjective experience.
    Mostly though, i’m with Meg.

  7. Making new friends in a new place is never easy. Sometimes it works out for people, sometimes it doesn’t, and there’s a myriad circumstances at play in either case.

    I can’t say whether people here are any nicer or friendlier than they are anywhere else in the world, but I can guarantee you no one here spends their time waiting around for the next CFA to waltz into their lives so they can befriend them.

    As Meg already pointed out, maybe your expectation of a friendly welcome was what stood in the way of your ever making friends here in the first place. Unfortunately your attitude has so soured to the idea at this point that you’ve essentially become your own worst enemy.

    Hopefully now that you’ve gotten this off your chest things will improve.

  8. TL;DR Fuck off back to the mainland.

  9. St. John's Resident

    I wholeheartedly agree with Meg and C.H Monster. People in St. John’s and wherever you live in NL are the same as everyone else in the world, we are all people. Yes you may have traveled and lived in many big cities all over the world and made great friends effortlessly which is great. I have traveled over the world too for 14 years and I always come home to St. John’s, trust me there are nice people and not so nice people all over the world, St. John’s again is no exception.
    - Now compared to major cities such as Toronto, NYC and Chicago St. John’s is smaller, there is a downtown scene similar to these cities but in general people have other hobbies and interests aside from the downtown scene.
    -Perhaps the people you interact with daily at work or school just don’t share the same interests. Many people have crafts groups, sports groups and many different social circles.

    -I do not personally know you, obviously. But I think if you just relax abit about the social scene and making alot of new friends right away it will get better. People in general are friendly just wait for them to warm up to you. Sometimes when you least expect it you make wonderful friends anywhere. So just chill and grab a coffee and do what you do and people will come. Dont hate on Newfoundlanders for being cold and unfriendly.

    Thanks

  10. Definitely agree with the above comments that it’s probably a combination of the built up hype behind The Friendly Newfoundlander and the fact that urban and rural NL are vastly different on the “friendly local” scale.

    Though something has to be said for the line: “The people of this island have to start opening their minds to making friends with people they haven’t known for generations.” I think there is some truth in this statement, speaking from my own experience. This city can be pretty darn cliquish.

  11. OP, What kind of things interest you? What are you hoping to experience here? What sort of hobbies do you have?

    I’m a local, and Id be more than happy to give some suggestions, if I’m able, on where to go to find some like-minded people to meet and possibly hang out with/get to know/ if I knew more about you and what you’re into.

    We aren’t all part of a clique in this town who kiss other cliquesters asses all day long, nor are we all unfriendly to newcomers.:)

    If you have any questions, shoot – I know this place pretty well.

  12. “people from the island have to start opening their minds to making friends…..” But your the one who can’t make a friend. Your rant sounds quite a bit patronizing to me. Is there anything else you would like us to do for you while we are at it? Maybe you are trying too hard and in return expecting too much. lighten up and stop thinking of it in terms of us and them,then you never know, the clouds might part – the sun might shine directly on you and then all of us cold Newfoundlanders will see just how wrong we were.

  13. Don’t move to Quebec City! Cliquish times one billion.

  14. princessconsuelabananahammock

    I’m a local, but, lived away for a long time and I find it kind of tough to find cool people to hang with. I think it may just be that everyone seems to know each other already and they just stick with who they know. I try to talk with strangers, but, I get the impression a lot of people seem frustrated with making the initial “get to know you” effort when they already have an established group and I don’t know any of the inside jokes, etc. It makes me kinda sad because I too left a really awesome little group of friends where I previously lived and I thought coming home would mean lots of new friends, but, oh well… I guess I’ll always have you to keep me company, internet.

  15. Maybe you’re just meeting the wrong people. Hell, I’m even nice to all the smelly traveler kids that come through this city.

  16. I feel sad that you’ve had this experience. I certainly didn’t when I moved here.

  17. The first mistake was assuming such a rant wouldn’t be undermined by volk sophistry until the cows came home by what are essentially very defensive and parochial souls..

  18. I’ve been living in NL for my whole life and I meet new people in NL every day, one’s that are from here and one’s that aren’t. One’s I haven’t known for generations and one’s that are really friendly and others that are complete arse’s. There really is no way to tell who you’re going to meet anywhere at any given time and if they’re going to be friendly or not. No one should claim that any city is a friendly city, you’re bound to meet people that would ruin that statement anywhere. I’ve met people in Halifax who were amazing and friendly, I’ve met some jerks while I was there too. I would just say that you haven’t met the right people for you yet, and I would also say that to assume that we all think that you’re only here for a short while or that were not open to meeting new people or making new friends is completely small minded in itself. How do you know the people you’ve encountered to be cold and unfriendly are even Newfoundlanders themselves? All of them? Do you know this for sure? I realize it’s what you’re probably experienced but we’re really not all like that. Anyway I’m sorry your expectations haven’t been fulfilled but maybe you should lower them? There are really great people here, I have a lot of different friends from “away” and they love it here and have a good group of Newfoundland friends. I sincerely hope you find some good like minded people soon, whether they be from here or not. All the best!

  19. Yes!! This is exactly what I’ve found! It’s like, people aren’t unfriendly, they just don’t want to bother at all. They already have all the friends they need anyways.

  20. Not to be rude but just because “so and so” comes from another place in the world, does that give them the right to act so entitled? Don’t get me wrong, I love people from different places, their experiences add to our Newfoundland pride.
    If Newfoundlanders are not friendly it’s because we had not had it easy and have struggled. Like everyone else we work hard and get through things the best way we can. The world is becoming a smaller place and perhaps Newfoundlanders are picking up manners from other parts of the world. It’s a little unfair to be so judgmental when there is clearly a lack of empathy on your part. Thanks for your opinion. Good Day.

  21. I think you are right. Newfoundlanders can be unfriendly. For sure. I have experienced this. Some of it is entitlement, some of it is ownership, but my “theory” is that Newfoundlanders are suspicious by nature, growing up where they were exploited by merchants, and struggled to survive, there is a Newfoundland attitude for sure. And we are suspicious, and rightfully so. Who wants the “merchants” to take over ever again! We all grew up with stories upon stories of the hard lives of our families. And the other thing is… we are nosey, we wants to find out what your family is like so we can trust ya. But that is not possible if you comes from away. It is all based on fear. We are accountable to our families here, but are you? Seperated by not much. Everyone asks me “are you related to this Baggs family or that one?” It is interesting because I recently sent a friend request on Facebook to a member of the “Baggs’” family who is pretty famous in artistic circles and did I get a reply? NO! So, you may have a point and we may need to get over ourselves……… Roger Baggs

  22. I am with Red.

  23. princessconsuelabananahammock

    Duuuuude, you’ve been dipping into some ayn rand, haven’t you. That shit’ll screw with your head.

  24. I moved here from Ontario. I’ve experienced a warm welcome from many and the cold shoulder from equally as many. My parents are from Newfoundland. I spent summers here growing up. I know the culture and it is part of my culture even though I wasn’t born or raised here. It saddens me to see some Newfoundlanders get defensive and be rude to me because I wasn’t born here. I still have Ontario plates on my car and have had people yell at me to go back to the mainland. How can’t some people see how ignorant and small minded this makes them look?. I’ve been told that I have no business taking a job from a “Newfoundlander”…yet it doesn’t seem to be a problem that people being born in NL have moved to the mainland to work?. I’ve read many comments from people responding to others people from away that have had a cold reception impying that the person away is the one not being friendly and/or complaining about the differences. I don’t think that is the problem. I know in my situation, I have been friendly and respectful of tradtion and culture and still get ignorant comments made to me. One thing I have observed here is that I find many Newfoundlanders will act unappropraitely but won’t take ownership and look at their behaviour in the situation. How do you expect someone from away to react when your reaction changes when you find out they’re not from around here?. I’m actually nervous now to tell people where I’m from, based on an anticipated reaction that I have recieved almost daily since I’ve been here. I find myself and my friends saying “but my/her parents are from here” to allievate the tension. Still, I’m trying not to let it jade me and remaning neutral with everyone I meet until they show me otherwise.

  25. What?

  26. i think everyone needs to chill out, honestly no one in newfoundland cares too much if your from away.. Not really. If you can hang out and not be a total arse hole then your set. I hate to keep coming back to this saying but the best way in my family to keep the peace (which is huge and a stereotypical 12 brothers and sisters family) is to not talk about politics or religion.. it really is the best saying and true.

    -If your comfortable in your own skin and “identity” be it a newfoundlander or mainlander/quebecois/ new yorker/ londoner… people will accept you for you and thats that. I think most people in life generally just look for people to be honest and real with themselves and their friends. No BS. Your set. :D Have a deadly week!

    The end.

  27. sometimes you cant change peoples minds. Also when talking about working away sometimes its risky because everyone knows someone who is either away or has been or moved for work. So its very close to home very personal and very easy to slightly get in a disagreement about a family members views on work and lifestyle. Which trust me, no matter how screwed up a family is here.. you dont mess with relatives..

    -This can be anyone because there are big family’s

    -If people dont agree to your views points and are being stubborn just leave em be. They will figure it out eventually and if you leave them be its less bad energy on you. Its their problem, theyll fix it eventually.

    - I just let people talk and sometimes we dont agree… and its allright, they can keep talking and its interesting to listen sometimes to understand them… as crazy as it sounds.

  28. So you’re down with stereotyping huh? Do you also go around saying all Jewish people are cheap and black people are lazy?

    Seriously, get over yourself. So you had a few bad experiences. Stop lumping us all into one category.

  29. I sympathize with your experience here in Newfoundland. I too believed the stereotype that Newfoundlanders are happy, friendly people. I have found that there is an suspicious, insular, exclusionary attitude here that I have never experienced elsewhere. It is even present in the language. The fact that there is a distinction made between “Townies”, “Baymen”, and those from “Away” implies not just a geographical segregation, but a conceptual one as well. As soon as I open my mouth, people can tell that I am from away, and that is generally the first, and last, thing I am asked about. I feel like I could live here for the rest of my life, marry a Newfounlander, raise my kids in Newfoundland, and I would still not be considered one of you. Sure, people are sometimes nice to my face, but I have not been welcomed into the community here. I had forgotten, before I moved here, what it felt like to not fit in and feel like an outsider. My experience in Newfoundland has humbled me.

  30. I am in the same boat. I missed the “make friends at MUN” stage, which is how most people seem to know each other, and I work with people who are much older than me and in a totally different life stage. I mostly end up hanging around with people that I have very little in common with.

  31. Unfortunately I have to agree. I think it may be a cultural thing. To say that people are the same everywhere is not always the case. I also have been extremely fortunate to have lived in a number of different countries and dozens of cities, thanks to my work, and I have not experienced this frustration anywhere else.

    Before moving to NL we did have a number of people from here tell us that as a ‘mainlander’ it will be difficult to make friends but once we do, ‘you’ll have friends for life’.

    Making meaningful connections with the people here is a frustration I have heard expressed by many people who have moved here from elsewhere. Some who have been here for more than 3 years. And I don’t think it’s a case of them waiting for people to ‘throw themselves’ at them, as a person commented above, ( a ridiculous comment). Many of these people are quite active in the community and some volunteer at various organizations.

    It’s such a shame because NL is such a beautiful province with many things to offer and making new friends would only enrich that experience.

  32. It’s not a stereotype if it’s a cultural aspect of a place. There is a huge difference.

  33. lover of good food

    What is quite obvious to me (a CFA of ten years duration) is that an awful lot of Newfoundlanders think of themselves as backwards.

    It’s impossible to develop a truly pleasant and easygoing relationship with a Newfoundlander who is innately convinced that he/she is inferior to you.

    I’ve heard Newfoundlanders say, “I don’t mind anybody coming here from away so long as they don’t think they’re better than us.” Well doh! In otherwords – You’re allowed to move here from away but don’t you dare excel at anything, because our fragile collective self esteem can’t take it.

    And they try to cover up their feelings of inferiority with false bravado. “We are the best people on earth. We are the friendliest people on earth.” On and on it goes. You only have to scratch the surface to see what’s really behind the constant bragging. It’s called low self esteem.

    I moved here with a tremendous respect for Newfoundlanders, but by Gawd, a lot of them seem to profoundly believe that they are not worthy of your respect, and they make sure to keep you at arm’s length (while smiling the phony smile). Behind the constant bragging is the most insecure group of people I’ve ever encountered. I wish to heavens they would get over it. If they did, life here would be a lot more pleasant.

    Also, it’s like if their family hasn’t known your family for generations, or at the very least, if you are not originally from Newfoundland, then you might as well be from Mars. I do not understand this line of thinking whatsoever. Personally, if I know someone’s name, then I know them. Simple as that. Just because someone is from here is no guarantee that the person is an ethical, trustworthy person.

    Do these people watch the news? Guess what? Newfoundlanders sometimes do bad things – just like anywhere else!

    I judge a person’s character by observing with my own eyes and with my own brain how they behave. And I don’t take self promotion at face value. Talk is cheap.

    Is the person honest? Do they treat others with respect – not just to their face but also behind their back? Do they behave responsibly? Do they mind their own business?

    I’d rather determine what people are like in this fashion than blindly (and sometimes wrongly) believe that someone is a great person simply because I’m from the same little town that they are from. I myself grew up in a tiny village on the mainland, but there were a few pretty unsavoury characters there. Conversely, I’ve also known people for just a few weeks and determined them to be good people with oustanding character.

    Newfoundlanders are wonderful when it comes to helping out others in a crisis situation – and there is a lot to be said for that. But when it comes to accepting people “from away” there’s a lot to be desired.

    I’ve talked to many other people who also moved here “from away.” The concensus is almost unanimous. We do not feel accepted by the “friendly” Newfoundlanders, and it’s not that we don’t like them, it’s that they don’t like us.

    Please, please Newfoundlanders, don’t assume we are looking down on you. If we *are* looking down on you in any way it’s because you brought it on yourself by treating us like we have no business being here and like you feel inferior to us.

    The Newfoundland culture is also extremely cliquish. You get cliquishness anywhere, but in Newfoundland, it’s like Cliques on Steroids. Like adolescence all over again. So Mr. or Mrs. Newfoundlander – if you do decide to befriend a CFA, please allow the person to be an individual. It’s everyone’s right to be an individual. That doesn’t mean they won’t give you a hand or be supportive of you. It just means they realize they have a right to be who they are (as do you – gasp!)

    NB: There are a few exceptions to the generalizations made above. Generally speaking, if a Newfoundlander has lived off the island for at least a couple of years – and vacations don’t cut it – the person actually has to have *resided* somewhere else – and then returned to Newfoundland, they will have gotten over the ridiculous inferiority complex. These people are often very pleasant to deal with.

  34. lover of good food

    “Newfoundlanders are picking up manners from other parts of the world.”

    I wish.

    In urban centres on the mainland people are accepted for who they are – not feared and kept at arm’s length for no good reason.

    I think any Newfoundlander living on the mainland, if being honest, would tell you exactly the same thing.

  35. lover of good food

    I’m guessing you are a young person …20 something?

    I do find that the 20 somethings here in Nfld tend to be FANTASTIC people – much more live-and-let-live than the older generations.

    At least there is hope.

  36. I was born in a town of about 1000 people in Newfoundland, to one “true” Newfoundlander parent and one who was raised here from early childhood by my European immigrant grandparents. Unfortunately, neither of them were born in that town. I was too young to realize why I was always treated as an outsider despite living there my whole childhood: my parents weren’t “from there”. I constantly got asked “who my father” was by every adult I encountered. When I grew up and moved to St. John’s, I found that people my own age were generally warm, friendly, and welcoming.
    So, in my experience at least, it was the older generation living in a smallish town that was the most xenophobic. In a city (even a small one) where many of the population were once “outsiders” it was much easier to find acceptance.
    It’s too bad I was made to feel like I wasn’t a true Newfoundlander for most of my life.

  37. where are you hanging out? all i gotta say is your meeting the wrong newfies. there’s good n bad everywhere… maybe your attracting the wrong crowd. good luck… i hope you meet some of the fantastic newfies that i find at every corner…

  38. People here suck

    I was the original poster of this rant.
    I am impressed by the comments/replies left and the bipolar topic it seems to have become. I had noticed this was published in the current scope so I guess the editors of this magazine agree or, at the very least, see the value in controversy.
    I want to offer apology to anyone that took offense to the original post, and I mean that. I wasn’t trying to stereotype against Newfoundlanders.
    I think one of the comments summed up well what I was trying to say in that the culture of this city is to not associate with strangers. Cliquey is a good description of this city.
    My perceptions of what this place was before coming here weren’t based on tourism commercials or anything like that, they were based on Newfoundlanders I met outside of Newfoundland. Based on how these individuals were towards me or my family I was led to believe things were different here than what they really are.
    I grew up in Halifax so I am from the region. The point of it all is, if I go to a bar in Halifax, grab a beer, sit at the bar and spend the evening there I will, and have, met people. The same can be said of most of the other cities I have been or lived in, especially in Chicago where it is almost overwhelming how friendly complete strangers can be. Saint John’s is not like that at all. I have gone out here, when I first moved in town, gone to the pub by myself to try and meet folks with no luck. My behavior is no different here than what it was at home or wherever. There is an obvious lack of interest in outsiders here, that is undeniable.
    Nowadays I have made friends from work so it isn’t as though I am starving for friends anymore as much as I am annoyed that there is no interaction between people unless there is familiarity. That isn’t just all on the locals, this city has tons of imports, I get that, I am one of them. The point of it all is that the culture of this city is to be cliquey and that is what drives me.
    Now you may say, go away then. Go back from where you came etc. I had noticed a lot of those comments but you clowns who have said those things have to realize, your province is going to continue to grow and you can’t accomplish what you have to without the aid of outsiders. Whether you want to accept that or not, it doesn’t matter we are here and our numbers are growing. Telling us to just go away isn’t going to help you because in a lot of instances our presence is for the good of the province. In summary, drop the go back where you came from crap, because frankly, it makes you look like ignorant red neck cross burning clan members.
    The one thing I want to say is that I appreciate how much some of you love your home. Enough to get upset at my notion that this place is not friendly. Your day to day life is likely different to mine though, if you have grown up in town. Familiarity dictates quality of social life here so the next time you see a stranger at the bar or at a coffee shop and there is a brief notion of human contact, why not say hello? Where is the harm in asking how’s your day going? Counter to that, having someone say that to you isn’t an act of assault or display of an aberrant personality.
    In the end, I don’t want to come to your house for supper, just a hello will do.

  39. Alright I do get your point. I have lived in Toronto and Alberta and have found it a little easier to make friends and be accepted.

    Perhaps what I said was a little UNFAIR. I grew up here and yes there are times where it’s cliquish and cold. (I’m quiet and artsy in unconventional ways.) In those times I had to be resourceful and find my own way. St. John’s is what it is, acceptance is the way to go.

    Best of luck OP.

  40. Sadly, I have to agree. I lived here until I was 29, moved away for 18 years and when I came back my family were all gone and most of my old friends had moved away. I’ve been back four years and still don’t have any real friends.
    I lived in PEI most of the time I was away and found it the same there. Even though my husband’s family had been there for over 200 years and he and my children were born there, I was never accepted as an Islander. In fact, people from “away” have found it so bad over there that they have formed a FB group which now has 688 members who get together regularly.
    I think people in their 20s form their social groups at that time and don’t even think about people who might not know anyone. I have over 100 of my former high school classmates on my facebook but very few have ever tried to “friend” me in real life. I have tried, believe me, but, as I said, people have their social groups and they don’t think to invite you in.

  41. Something that I find happens here is once your mainland accent comes out, some people get defensive, and either think you’re pretentious or you’re “puttin’ on airs” when all you’re doing is speaking the way you have your whole life. It’s unfortunate but it does happen, it’s happened to me many times and it can be very frustrating when you’re trying to meet people and make friends, but in a way it helps weed out the assholes who would actually judge you by where you’re from, maybe you’re running into that when meeting people, which sucks, but try not to let it get you down, it’s a shitty obstacle to overcome, but not everyone is like that, and the people that are, aren’t really worth your time anyways.

  42. Newfoundlanders aren’t friendly. It’s a common misperception. but they will talk at ya nonstop – loves to hear themselves talk…. About what a friendly culture they have…. Omitting the fact that friendliness is exclusive to locals (and tourists who are leaving soon enough that they’re presence doesn’t threaten the insular island identity here).

  43. What’s the name of the FB page? I am interested. Thanks!

  44. Nicole, are you talking about the PEI group I mentioned? Do you live there?

  45. http://vimeo.com/34333528

  46. Sorry, my mistake, thought you were talking about a FB group in St. John’s.
    Too bad we could use one here!!

  47. Well I’m originally from Newfoundland but semi-new to St. John’s and I agree with and sort of have the same problem as princessconsuelabananahammock and like Gambit the MUN thing didn’t work for me either. I’ve been here for some time and know very few people. Maybe we should start our own little group lol! I’d be up for it!

  48. Starting a FB page for people who just moved to NL/St. John’s from elsewhere and looking to meet people is a great idea. I think I may start that, why not.

  49. let me know when it’s up and running!

  50. What if you actually are a douche bag.
    Ok I have no idea what you have said to people while you are trying to be witty.
    But maybe it made you seem like an arse.

    And if that’s not the case then who are these people you are meeting.
    Maybe they are just tools. Go look for people interested in the same stuff as you.
    Join a group or class or something.. and there are always co-workers!

    I’ve met people from outside the province I’ve loved and a few I hated. So it’s either you suck, or you suck at making friends (which you claim to be not true), or the people you meet suck. But I know that place is not full with nothing but unfriendly people.

  51. Newfoundlanders are NOT friendly. I have lived in Europe for 10 years, and recently returned. Here are some observations…

    1. Newfoundlanders have a dangerous tribal mentality its US and THEM
    2. Newfoundlanders have not shaken their Pride and Poverty nature
    3. Newfoundlanders love to complain but rarely do anything about anything….
    4. Newfoundlanders feel better about themselves if they have a lot of ‘in jokes’ with each other.. childish and innane
    5. Newfoundlanders are extremely sneaky, smart and dishonest
    6. Newfoundlanders need to travel other places besides ‘up north’ ‘alberta’ and ‘tornto’ chashing some newfie dream…
    7. Any ideas we have of ‘CULTURE’ have been sold out to trinket stores selling kitchy mummers, puffins and codfish memoribilia….
    8. The ‘mummers parade’ is patronizing…
    9. Most newfoundlanders I know are shopaholics, alcoholics and lacking peace of mind…
    10. Newfoundland women are competative…. they glare at each other and are catty…
    11. I’m a newfoundlander and I’m not proud of the place this has become… we need to develop a better world view so that we can more greatly understand this so called culture we cling to however rarely take part in anymore…
    12. Go to costco and solve all your problems
    13. All the ‘art downtown crowd’ are incesteous and insecure… painful!
    14. Downtown st.john’s has become a gentrified hole… george street is tackier than ever… drivers are out of their minds and everyone is using drugs to compensate for the fact they can’t even jig a cod or cut a log anymore…

  52. Great…another know-it-all with their sweeping generalization of all Newfoundlanders.

  53. downtownie, go back to Europe if it’s so bad. And learn to spell while you’re there.

  54. Sweeping, yes… generalizations… yes. Accurate… mostly. I think that this is a very important time in our Islands story to start asking some tough questions of ourselves. Newfoundland has always seen itself in terms of being under the thumb of Britain or Cananda. Indeed it has never come to terms with its failure at self detirmination. This has created a dysfunctional approach to the outsider and to each other. There is a lot of Tall Poppy Syndrome here.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tall_poppy_syndrome

    this disneyland version of the Newfie is antiquated. I think its important for us to welcome the outsider.. considering we ourselves come from ‘outsiders’ who desimated a native population…

  55. ‘spelling mistakes’ social media comments is grasping at straws… really… dig a little deeper…

  56. Also this ‘go back to Europe’ or ‘back to the mainland’ comment thing is an inmature response to not wanting to hear criticism. Lets just stay here and mate with our cousins… forever… Nationalism is NOT always possitive.

  57. And “Let’s just stay her and mate with our cousins…” is a very mature comment.

  58. downtownie, yes, I should follow your mature and deep example. We don’t want people here who think we’re sneaky, dishonest and incestuous. There’s a difference between criticism and being just plain mean and nasty.

  59. semantics … sad when the need to ‘win’ an argument becomes more important than the debate/issue itself…

  60. I just returned from a visit to South America and the U.S., where I met a variety of people from there and from Canada. In each instance, I told them about Newfoundland and Labrador, and how much I love it here. I urged them to take any opportunity to come visit and, if they do, to please call me in advance so that I could arrange to take them around St. John’s (my home) and even as far as Gros Morne/L’Anse aux Meadows. I really hope that they take me up on that offer – I’m looking forward to taking some vacation time to show them the sites!

  61. First of all, please don’t generalize….

    1. I’m a Newfoundlander and as far as I’m concerned, we’re all US (global community) – there is no THEM.
    2. I’m a Newfoundlander and never had a “pride and poverty” nature; therefore I can’t shake it.
    3. I’m a Newfoundlander and one of my most notable sayings is “let’s ger ‘er done!”
    4. I’m a Newfoundlander and don’t know any “in jokes”.
    5. I’m a Newfoundlander and don’t really know how to respond to this one. With whom are you comparing all Newfoundlanders without knowing all Newfoundlanders? Why would we be sneaky and dishonest? Do you have any examples that can be attributed to everyone in the province?
    6. I’m a Newfoundlander, not a Newfie. In case you aren’t aware, that’s a derogatory term used by people who don’t know better. Now you do. I’ve travelled to many places, including France, Germany, Belgium, Italy, Malta, Czech Republic, Austria, Liechtenstein, Switzerland, the Netherlands, Norway, Denmark, England, Ireland, Scotland, Panama, Mexico, other parts of Canada, and several states in the U.S. Is this not enough to develop a more “worldly attitude”?
    7. I don’t believe that you truly understand the term “culture”, and have you visited tourist shops in any of the other places you’ve visited (assuming that you’ve visited other places)? I have and I can tell you that they’re all the same with regard to the usual trinkets. If you want authentic souveniers, try asking a “local”.
    8. The mummering tradition originate in Ireland and England (I believe), and was carried over to many parts of North America, including Newfoundland and Labrador, Boston, and Chicago, to name a few. Like anything, it’s value is subjective. I have never personally participated, but don’t begrude others their right to do so.
    9. I’m a Newfoundlander and I despise shopping. For the record, I also dislike fish and seafood. Go figure. I’m also very content and enjoy great peach of mind, thank you very much.
    10. I’m a Newfoundland woman and don’t believe that I’m particularly “catty”, though I’ll let others be the judge of that. Competition is healthy and a requirement for progress. Rather that than apathy.
    11. I’m a Newfoundlander and am quite proud of our accomplishments. I’m also happy to be part of Canada and hope that other Canadians feel the same warmth for their homes as I do for mine.
    12. I don’t have a Costco membership, so I can’t follow your advice on this.
    13. Not having asked all of the “art downtown crowd” about their sexual excapades, I don’t know if this is true. Perhaps someone could do a poll and post it here at a later date.
    14. I don’t “do” George Street; have found that drivers here are much the same as elsewhere – some good; some bad; I’ve never done drugs, and wouldn’t even know where to find them; and I’ve never jigged a cod or cut lumber (I assume that you mean this commercially).

    As you can see, since I’m a Newfoundland and don’t seem to fit any of your 14 observations, your comments that “all Newfoundlanders” do is clearly erroneous. Again, please don’t generalize.

    To the fellow from Chicago who has difficulty making friends, all I can say is keep trying. I’m sure you will find friendly people all around you.

    :-)

  62. I’ve been here for 30 years. I’ve had the same friends for 20. I’ve got what I need, and like most of us, I don’t want any more.

  63. Hello,

    I’m going to try to get it together this month and start a FB page for newcomers to NL.

    In the meantime you can check out the Green Drinks chapter that has been started here in ST. John’s, (by a newcomer to NL).
    Here’s a link for more info.-
    http://greenstjohns.blogspot.ca/

    Most of the people that go to this are from out of province, it’s a great way to meet people and the next get together is this coming Wed. @ Bridie Molloy’s.

    I’m going next week, hope to see some of you there!

  64. interested observer

    just the fact that the term “come from away” exists, and everyone knows the term and all of its implications, indicates there is a serious problem here

  65. …or else it implies that a sense of humour about your identity and origins is strongly prevalent.

  66. This is exactly one of the reasons why it’s hard to meet people here!

  67. Likewise, the fact that the term “newfie” exists and carries a lot of negative connotations with most people “from away” also is a problem.

  68. lover of good food

    I’m a mainlander and worked for years on the mainland with Newfoundlanders. No one – not a single soul in my workplace – ever made Newfie jokes about the Newfoundlanders behind their backs OR referred to them as “Newfies.”

    I know several mainlanders now living here in Nfld who would never dream of referring to anyone as a “Newfie.”

    It’s been many decades since I heard a “Newfie” joke. Mainlanders really are sooo past that (fortunately).

    But so many Newfoundlanders LOVE to believe that they are being persecuted behind their back and being called “Newfie.” It seems to be a perverse source of pride.

    So sorry to burst your bubble. You really do need to get past the need to feel persecuted.

  69. THIS.

    Every time there’s a story about Harper, there are so many comments about how everyone on the mainland gets together and secretes hate towards Newfoundland. Personally, I think the last time I heard a ‘Newfie’ joke was about grade 2…and otherwise, no one I knew ever talked about the province. To me, it’d be like sitting around talking about Manitoba or New Brunswick. I don’t understand why mainlanders would commit so much of their time to sitting around thinking about how much they hate Newfoundland (even though they don’t hate Newfoundland, they don’t even have an opinion on the place. (except that it looks nice from all of the tourism commercials.))

  70. I’m a Newfie, born and bred, and have absolutely no problem with the term “Newfie”. I sure don’t want to be called a Newfoundland and Labradorian.

  71. Well don’t worry about it, because you can’t be born on an island and a mainland.

  72. Frank, I was born here and lived here for over 30 years but when I came home from being away for 18 years I found it very hard to make friends because everyone has their own little circles and it’s very hard to get it. All my old friends moved away and I have no family left here.

  73. lover of good food

    Linda you’re the exception to the rule. I’ve heard many, many Newfoundlanders voice objection to the term “Newfie.” That’s why I never use it.

  74. I am just beginning to discover my roots. I am from NYC, grandma Alice Powers of St. John’s all the way back to Pierce Butler of St. John’s, more than 200 plus years. Reading these posts kind of scares me. I have Heferans, Grants and Butlers. I have no idea whether such a family history helps me or not. I was seriously thinking of throwing in the towel in NY and moving up there. My Boston Powers were very reserved people but they endured a lot. Any advice for a geneologic NWF descendant? Look up my people? don’t bother? Help

  75. Hey There All, I was born here and have grown up here for all My life (40). I am only happy to be called a Newfie, you see i have the ability to laugh at myself and even some of the idiotic things I have heard about my culture. But if I were to discuss your country and joke and carry on about some of the idiotic things in your culture, Oh let’s see… George W (jr) and what a mess he made and the fact he was voted in TWICE. You see that could ruffle some feathers. I have also traveled and have had the great opportunity to work with people from all walks of life and all types of cultures. I grew up with people and went to school numerous families from other countries. I still have most of them on Facebook, and those I don’t I stay in contact through emails. I have also had to defend both my way of life and my cultural background from individuals from those cultures as well. Which i would love to do at any point. I have heard it all from “Do you live in an Igloo” “Do you have electricity?” to my Favorite… from and Arrogant Yankie “Don’t we Own Canada”. EVERY city has it’s idiots and assholes. We are a proud and Protective people. To say we are the friendliest may not be correct, but I would much rather be here than anywhere else. Great places to visit but I wouldn’t want to live there. For the most part we could care less where your from, as long as you are friendly and not a complete Dick, then your alright in my books. But if ya don’t like it here, go back the way ya came.

  76. Not sure if you’re a man or a woman but, I thank you.
    Your comments are the most concise power points of Newfoundlands true facts of life.
    For three years now I have lived here as a newcomer from Alberta.
    I could write a novel about my disgust and contempt for the average Newfoundlanders lack of respect for human rights, especially those of children. Rural Newfoundland is a cesspool of corruption where children are held back from civilised society and used as a source of income. It disgust me knowing that child services is a part of it all and looks the other way not to offend family and friends. Forget morality; Newfoundland has none.
    Kudos to you for being one of the civilised few who have opened their eyes.
    Merci

  77. Whether Newfoundland likes it or not, this Island and all of its resources will be taken over by every country on Earth(why do you think the railway is gone???)This so you wouldn’t be able to create industry of your own….Wake Up!!!!!
    Any Newfoundlander with a quarter of their brain could see this if they we not so screwed up on prescription drugs.
    Newfoundland has to open its eyes and stop trying to hold back the inevitable or be doomed to slavery for generations to come.Stop working cheap,and,stop fighting with the world. Get with the program. You can not win with the attitude you have on the go. Plus , there is no war or animosities with the mainland. Its all in your insecure heads.
    You’ve been warned.
    What you do about it is all up to you. I have a feeling you’ll do nothing. Tradition says so.

  78. We’ve been warned? By who? Oh no, not Steve!

    Go back to where you came from you arrogant prick.

  79. Alberta hey….explans the ignorance and arrogance of your posts.

  80. Steve hasn’t phrased it very diplomatically, but there is something to take from this – the current oil- and mining-driven pieces of the job boom are a) temporary b) funnel resource-based wealth out of the province, and c) historically leave provinces with the high cost of clean-up. These are nonrenewable resources that belong to the people of this province – we should make sure that their exploitation is pursued in an environmentally responsible way (we’ll pay for it if it isn’t), and that profits are funneled into substantial, long-term investments in the province’s fiscal & social health.

    We haven’t been doing this well so far, but we can do better. Models to follow include Norway’s investment of offshore oil profits, rather than Alberta’s heavily subsidized oil sands sell-off.

  81. Sorry, wrote that in a bit of a pissed off haste reading it first thing this morning. I realize that not everything is rosy and perfect here and Steve does have a few good points but unfortunately, put a bit arrogantly. Personally, I am tired of these types of rants from people who feel they have a superiority over NLers and think they know what is best for us. Not all of us have this type of attitude he is talking about. I am a young, hard-working professional trying to contribute to this place that I love so much and it pisses me off reading stuff like this and people who seem to get enjoyment by putting this place down.

  82. I appreciate Pre-defeated’s comment. Mine as more of a rant; However, I agree, Norway is the model we have to endeavour to follow. Ralph Klien ws hasty when he sold out many years ago.

    I feel it is paramount that all Newfoundlanders start placing a higher value on themselves, at least for the sake of the children coming up to the work force.
    You are worth more than the minimum wage that almost anyone will jump at when they need a job.
    As for going back to the mainland s East ender says. If I did leave my wife’s family would laterally fall to pieces without my help at virtually everything. They are not well an need a strong knowledgable man around. I don’t abandon my people for money in the west.Not Even a Newfoundlander….and trust me , Newfoundland has given me few reasons to praise her after being treated like crap by amost everyone I meet even if I’m there to help.
    Its called Morality and Ethics.
    Thank You Pre-defeated . Well said.

  83. To EastEnd:
    Its all good, thanks.
    I’m 52 and super healthy. Probably see things a little different than younger people. Less pride and more politics perhaps.
    I am genuinely concerned that the youngsters are prepared to rally on a global scale when the world zero’s in on our province. Where I grew up in North York Ontario Is almost 80% Chinese owned, including street sign’s written in Chinese. They took advatake of my Mother and bought her old home for a fraction of its future value as a chinese community. It’s happening now in St John’s and very few adults are really paying attention. It’s not only China but also home grown real estate moguls Arab Nation too.
    Welcoming newcomers is the morally right thing to do, but not at our expense and gullibility.
    I watched my Ontario and Alberta culture be swallowed up and destroyed . There is no more home for me anymore.
    Please don’t let that happen here. Be kind but “Stand on guard for thee”

  84. you, my friend, are excatly what mainlanders are talking about….being a jerk just for the sake of it….you should be ashamed of yourself.

  85. It’s true, people here aren’t very friendly .. to outsiders. To eachother they are best of friends, they communicate through a series of grunts and gibberish which they pass off as language. It’s lose-lose if you’re not from here, if you stick to your own linguistic-set you’ll never gain camaraderie (unless you have a funny accent and then you might qualify for a sort of Fez-like existence (that 70′s show reference). If you attempt to start calling people B’y and saying where are you to and other local fare you will get some weird looks and awkward reactions since nobody likes a poser and it makes you look like you’re trying far too hard to be liked. Cultural integrity is important and I think an outsiders best bet is to find some special sort of niche culture, such as a sporting club, or other clique which has their own linguistic-set which supersedes the local one, within such an exclusive bubble you can converse on a level playing field.

  86. I am a Newfoundlander born and raised.
    After reading all the complaints about my province and the inane responses from fellow Newfoundlanders; I have to say. Steve is right.
    If Newfoundland won’t learn from her own mistakes then at least we can learn from the Mainlanders mistakes ,now so evident in all major centres.
    Ignoring wise advise may be Newfoundlands biggest mistake. Advise from a none political civilian source.
    Most City dwelling Mainlanders have seen what is happening here in their own cities many decades ago.
    Mainland children are taught how to deal with the New World Order. I have seen this first hand in my travels throughout the west.
    I am ashamed of the way my own family shelter’s their children from the rest of the world. raising them to wave the Newfoundland flag and pretend the other 6.5 billion people of Earth are irrelevant.
    New News Flash !!! Six and one half Billion to 500 thousand means we are in n position to argue or fight.
    So lets all forget about welfare cheques and wearing pyjama’s all day,get off our asses and start being creative and industrious like our relatives in the United Kingdom. England by the way is the same size as Newfounland give r take a few quare mile, and manufactures everythingunder the sun including fighter jets. Newfoundlands prior dependence on fish is another point of shame for all Newfoundlanders.
    We never once thought the future was coming. It’s here

  87. “The Mainlander Bar and Grill” ?

  88. I gotta say that this thread disturbs me…

    Newfoundland, like everywhere else on this planet, has a mix of both the good and the bad. Sure, some people won’t be friendly. Some people might even be ar$ehole$. And some people are solid gold.

    My advice to someone who is having a hard time meeting people would be to get out and do things that make you happy. I think that being alone plays a great role in people’s lives and teaches them a great deal about themselves. Time spent alone and reflection are good for the soul. Doing things that you enjoy and that make you happy will also be good for every part of your health, mental, physical and spiritual.

    It sounds like you might have a little bit of resentment towards people here, and maybe even towards your family… I am of the opinion that like attracts like, and whenever i have felt the worst in my life I have given off the worst vibes… and attracted the worst kinds of things. Maybe you need to work on yourself, do some self nurturing, make yourself happy, and go out into your world with a bit of a new attitude. Now, you might think that this is bull$hit, but if you are at all openminded, give it a go, what have you got to lose?

    I live with a crowd of people from away who adore this province and its people. I myself was living off the island, both on the mainland and abroad for six years and just moved home last year… I often go out by myself, whether it’s to hike or to hit a pub. Sometimes I meet people and sometimes I don’t, but that is just life.

    We are a small island and yeah we are certainly behind the times in some respects… we definitely don’t have the productivity and diversity of england… that’s an absurd expectation for a tiny population of predominantly white catholics and protestant people who typically lived off the fishery. I myself don’t think that our history is shameful in the least, and I am in fact proud of our old ways and proud of the ingenuity that has come from the collapse of the fishery. We have discovered new ways to develop our beautiful province, but we haven’t gone overboard yet either and I hope we never do. Newfoundland is a bit of a hidden gem in my opinion and I hope it never gets truly ‘discovered’!!

    I wish you luck… and i hope you run into some of the newfoundlanders that will make you glad that you live here.

  89. Yes, the world is made to be such a better place by ‘industrious nations’ manufacturing fighter jets and other wonderful innovations that contribute so vastly to humanity. Perhaps we could become a second China, the world always wants more polluting plastic products which they get bored of after a day and toss in the trash. A point of shame that we lived a simpler life, closer to nature? Really? A point of shame that we are happy with our lives and don’t need artificial ‘purchased’ happiness?

  90. Also, you do realize that the English did not come by their manufacturing and financial power through some inner ‘creativity’ and ‘industriousness’, right? England gained its power through force of arms, Machiavellian politics and essentially enslaving half the inhabitable world while helping to provoke wars between other powers to ensure no side ever gained hegemony on the Continent to challenge them on their island hide-away. Today the result is a polluted, treeless, crowded, violent society, bristling with Nukes and toe-ing the line for the USA. You really respect that more than some Newfies waking up in a small coastal village of 100, going out at the crack of dawn to fish the waters their fathers anf grandfathers and great grandfathers fished, to provide food for their family? You prefer men who get on ships and sail half way across the world to point guns at ‘brown people’ in Africa and Asia and force them to provide wealth so the ladies at home can dress better and the men can live in big ego-mansions? I’ll even take a double shot of pyjama/welfare/skeetism over the atrocity which is Anglo-saxon global politics.

  91. then why do you stay here??

  92. again…the rudeness shows through…just because some is from Alberta DOES NOT make them ignorant or arragant.
    As Newfoundlanders we despise being “tarred by the same brush”. Yet this is exactly what you have done here????

  93. You should read what has been written…by Steve and everyone else and then do some research on the rest of the country…
    Walking around downtown Toronto last summer, while I was on vacation…WE as WHITE Canadians were the minority…St.John’s
    is indeed heading that way.

  94. Lynn,

    The vast majority of NL’ers are not sitting on their ass wearing pyjamas all day long. In fact, I don’t know anyone like that. My parents were both raised in rural NL, and they had strong work ethics which they instilled in their children. Sad to think about who you seem to hang around with.

  95. I was born and raised in rural NL as well…thats not where I was speaking of…walk around St.John’s…go to the mall…you will see people everywhere in PJ’s…and I didn’t say the majority…let alone the vast majority.
    I simply believe that when you leave the house…YOU PUT CLOSE ON…and yesy there are a great deal of people here in their PJ’s ALL day long, and not just at home…out in public.

  96. ruh roh shaggy, we have a racist on our hands.

  97. Lynn, you should really quit while you’re ahead, you’ve exposed that you are a racist, you have displayed a very narrow-minded definition of what is considered ‘acceptable fashion wear’, you have an unhealthy xenophobia towards outsiders and an inferiority complex which causes you to look down upon the very traits which make Newfoundland so special and -not- the polluted, crowded, violent “industrious nations” which you consider superior and something to aspire to.

    Unfortunately there are far too many “Lynns” in this province, unable to embrace the identity of a lower income, culturally rich, natural paradise, but instead mired in self-contempt and embracing the aspirations of a capitalism of rapine, deceit and brutality. In a lot of ways, it’s the mainlanders who move here who understand what there is that is special about this place, they voluntarily gave up the hustle and bustle of big cities, they definitely didn’t come here to get rich or wow’ed with modern stimulations, they came to escape that hell which so many Newfies ignorantly and naively think is a utopic future to be fought for and won. Lynn and others of her ilk, there are lots of cities and places with factories producing fighter planes and other weapons of war, they have large popolutions crammed so close together that the people can hardly stand one another and violence is a regular occurrence. Perhaps you should move to these places and leave this paradise to the mainlanders who appreciate what a gem you are ungrateful enough to want to ruin.

  98. It isn’t racist, it’s true. I’m interested to see how Caribana will turn out this year, with all of the gun violence going on in Toronto lately. I bet the cops are on full alert. People get shot at that festival every year (and yeah I have been there, it actually can be intimidating to be the only white person in a huge crowd of black gangbangers), but this year it might be even worse.

    White Canadians aren’t the ones who commit these vicious crimes.

  99. SHADOWWOOD…
    Racist??? Why because I made the observation that while in downtown Toronto…white people seem to be the minority…that’s NOT racist, it’s the truth. As for imbracing the low income people of our province…well…about 70% of my extended family is low income…I too am considered working poor…BUT I STILL GET DRESSED WHEN I LEAVE THE HOUSE. If wearing PJ’s in public is considered fashion then Im Calvin Klien. As for “outsiders’, ‘mainlander’ etc (very poor terms, its not ‘them’ against ‘us’) we are ALL Canadians…your color, race and especially what province you come from make NO difference). FYI:I’m married to man from Alberta…a province I’ve never been to. I have also been married to a Newfoundander (who died 4 years ago). Both of them WONDERFUL men.

  100. ST. JOHN’S IS NOT NEWFOUNDLAND!!!!!!! it is no different than any other city just smaller. And yes there are many unfriendly people here just as in any other place. I’ve lived all over canada and to this date I have no friends from these places. Making friends is hard it’s just the way it is. “newfoundlanders are the nicest people on earth” probly, probly not, what is it your looking for? in any case there are hundreads of other communities on this island of ours, try other areas before passing judgement on all people of the island. St. John’s has become a place just like any other and is not representitive of the true newfounland way. Also Like breeds Like That is all.

  101. The racism comes in the implied idea that being a white minority in Toronto and St. John’s turning into the same situation is somehow a negative. Only someone who was hostile to other races would think becoming a ‘white minority’ was something to be afraid of. “Walking around downtown Toronto last summer, while I was on vacation…WE as WHITE Canadians were the minority…St.John’s is indeed heading that way.” Your intelligence is probably too low to even grasp what you said in its full implications so I will retract what I said about you being a racist, instead you are just ignorant and type things you don’t fully understand the way in which they will be perceived by others.

    You sure have an axe to grind with people who wear pyjamas. You do realize that it’s simply an abritrary societal distinction that has decided that pygamas are ‘for sleep/home’ and not ‘outside’, that pyjamas provide just as much warmth and protection from teh elements as a pair of jeans or shirt and obscure views of naked body parts that might offend some sensibilities. Join the fashion police tho, you seem fit for the role.

  102. You’re revealing your provincialism there Gordo. I’ve lived in Montreal and Vancouver and visited Toronto ofte. The “black gangbangers” as you call them are more often than not just blacks who embrace a certain fashion aesthetic and are enrolled in University and just as bland and unconfrontational as your average white, if not more so. I’ve always felt very safe around the blacks of Canada, they have a certain respect for things that a white person often doesn’t have, which I think comes from being raised by very strong disciplinarian maternal figures, where white kids are raised by doting parents who spoil their little wunderkind and make him feel he is entitled to everything and better than everyone. From living in several buildings I can also say blacks are the very best neighbours to have, extremely discreet, quiet and respecful, whites are amongst the worst, loud creatures who blast music and have parties constantly. Don’t be afraid of the blackside Gordo, their skin is darker, they wear baggy clothes, but you know that’s just on the surface right? I know they must seem very alien and obscure, very different and scary, they look different from what you are used to, but they’re aiight ;)

  103. Who do you think you are???? At no point in time did I say anything hostile towards anyone… believe what I said as that it didn’t matter our color or race or what province we come from…we are AL Canadians…is that hostile…hmmm… don’t think so. And to suggest that I am ingnorant or that I’m of low intelligence…well okI’ll stoop to your level…take of your PJ’s get dressed and go look for a job!

  104. I hate to point out spelling mistakes as I don’t necessarily think they are reflective of a persons intelligence, but considering your vehement denial of being of low intelligence, the juxtaposition with your abhorrent spelling/typing/sentence formation is difficult to ignore.. just putting that out there. As to who I think I am, well that should be evident by my profile picture shouldn’t it Sherlock?? Once again you seem oblivious to the full import of your remark that: ““Walking around downtown Toronto last summer, while I was on vacation…WE as WHITE Canadians were the minority…St.John’s is indeed heading that way.” The implication is pretty self-apparent – you went to a city and felt like a “white minority”, you did not like it and you are afraid lest it happen in St. John’s. Am I missing something there? You can’t simultaneously harbour such a sentiment while attempting to parade yourself as some Politically correct non-racist. You are a racist, plain and simple, either change your ignorant attitudes and stop the racist remarks or embrace your identity as a racist which at least is something semi-respectable, this two-faced approach tho makes you look both stupid and a coward.

  105. Best comment in this entire conversation.

  106. Newfoundlander baymen

    I am from Newfoundland and I must agree with you about the whole not being friendly thing, but your judging all of newfoundland just by st.johns alone. I find people from st.johns are ignorant and arent easy to make friends with by far. You should move to one of the bays, they are totally different and nicer. I have made friends from st.johns but only because they were originally from a bay.

  107. What I hate most about Newfoundlanders is that they lie to you! Yes folks, Lie!!! They tell you anything they think you want to here whether it’s true or not. Like, ‘Oh yes, we are always having problems finding people with your job experience, you will definitely be hearing from us with a job offer.’ Over and over. No phone calls yet. And they break the rules constantly! Like, EVERYONE’S AN ELECTRICIAN. Any joe blow can go in a wire a house. Even ones who haven’t even taken a pre-apprenticeship course. No inspector ever checks up on them. They charge less than REAL electricians, they never pull permits, but because their families have lived here for generations they get all the work! As for their workmanship, well, it’s just a miracle there haven’t been a lot more ‘electrical’ accidents than they have. I know you don’t really want to be part of Canada, you only joined to get the EI stamp, but now that you are part of Canada let’s try place a bit of ‘catch up’ shall we and get with the 21 century. (You are backward, ignorant, lying morons.) Get educated, get up to date, or get out of Canada and fend for your bloody selves!!!

  108. As a mainlander, I’ve encountered more rudeness and standoffish behaviour in the bay than in the city, because I was from the mainland people thought that I felt I was better than them, irony at it’s finest. Everyone is going to have a different experience though, I don’t put my negative experience on everyone, I just happened to run into a few assholes that day.

  109. Jennifer, you are allowing your frustration at the challenge of finding a job to colour your statements, and as a result the things you are saying are judgemental, sweeping generalizations which do not have a lot of basis in reality. It is easy to blame “lying Newfoundlanders” as the cause of your/your spouse’s inability to find work – what you should actually consider is the major factor that is holding you back from finding work here, which is your negative attitude and your heaving self-righteousness.

    I am really amazed at the way people throw stereotypes at “Newfoundlanders” as a people as a way to explain away why they cannot be successful here, why they can’t make friends here, why the weather here is shitty or why we don’t have sidewalks, etc. You are so angry and so ready to blame others for your problems that you don’t even realize that the things you are saying are completely hateful. If you were stigmatizing a race instead of a province of people, you would never get away with making these types of generalizations. You need to grow up.

    The fact is that Newfoundland is a tiny island on the edge of the Atlantic ocean. There are not a lot of people here. Yes, people know each other, connections mean something. I am sure it is frustrating to have people you perceive as unskilled take work you feel you somehow deserve more, but with an attitude and a view of Newfoundland and of Newfoundlanders as shitty as yours, you don’t strike me as someone who deserves anything.

  110. Newfoundland is not the friendliest place in the world.

    You will have an easier time trying to find El Dorado… Such a place does not exist.

    I’ve lived in Ontario, Alberta, and Newfoundland.

    The nicest and friendliest people I’ve met along the way were also the most humble.

    I met numerous immigrants in Toronto who endured a lot of strife in their lifetime and who have relied upon the goodwill of others in the past. They were genuine and helpful and would not hesitate to be compassionate. It didn’t depend upon their nationality – Lebanese, Nigerian, Colombian, Pakistani, Polish…

    There are plenty of people I’ve known from rural Newfoundland, too, who’ve known good times and bad, who rely upon their community for support, and who give back according to their abilities. Their kindness to strangers and those in distress is the stuff of legend that you were expecting…

    Part of the problem today lies with “modernity” and the cult of the individual. Since we now work to support our consumption rather than our sustenance, we tend to be more selfish and protective of our property. Living in large cities, we tend to move about anonymously and the natural tendency to help or be diplomatic to others is gradually lost.

    With that said, St. John’s is an accumulation of over 100,000 personalities so you can’t expect everyone to be friendly in the best of times. Based on my own personal experience, however, I can agree that a lot of people here are insular and that they stay within familiar groups. I just don’t know that I’d go about painting everyone with the same brush. I’ve failed to create a large circle of friends in all my years of living here, but I know that you get what you put into it sometimes – honestly, being popular hasn’t been high on my priority list so I can’t blame others for not calling me up!

    Expect St. John’s to get even less friendly in the coming years, all the same, as the income disparity here widens and we become more and more alike other large cities. We’re finally catching up to the supposed “prosperity” that we’ve always been chasing after and we won’t know what to do with it when we catch it. It’s bringing a lot more social change than people realize, and a lot of it is bad…

    (PS to Jennifer – why troll a Newfoundland site if you hate us so much)

  111. There’s truth to what he is saying. When I go there to visit family, people there want to fight just because I am not form around there when I go to a bar or something.

    Many newfs are ignorant and close minded.

  112. What an ignorant comment.

  113. Thanks for proving his point.

  114. No thanks.

  115. What is it that you expect to find when you go out to the local bars in St. John’s. Just about everyone(NOT ALL) down there is drinking or doing some sort of drugs. They are all in an altered state of mind and you expect to go there and make friends. Every place on earth has it’s share of idiots and assholes. Newfoundland is no different. You are just looking in the places to make friends. Come out around the bay. We are sure to make you feel a lot more welcome than the townies. Beware, there are assholes and idiots everywhere.

  116. Lived there for much of a winter, in 1981. Absolutely agree with you. They have a big chip about people from “Da Mainland”.

    Well, who the hell forced them to join Canada? As I recall, they voted for union, and it saved their resentful butts!

  117. ’81, hey?

  118. Well, I find this extremely offensive. I’m a newfie and have been all over the land so far, you meet those who are kind and those who are not, Every city has their bitch crew,correct?
    Not only that, but I’m sorry for you’re experience, no one should have that kind of experience when they first move to a place, in a sense, I’ve been through the same thing.
    Also, Halifax is apart of Nova Scotia, Not Newfoundland, hun, do your searching before “ranting” about a place.
    Ever hear the term “dont judge a group by a few individuals”? You should use it.
    Secondly, My best friend is a Mainlander, she’s lived all over Newfoundland and she had even said “When you come here to Newfoundland its so much warmer, the cashiers in stores don’t just check your items out and then say good day with a fake smile like they do in other places, they stop and have a chat with you and call you lovie or hun or ‘me lovey’ even if they don’t know you.”
    To be honest, I’ve met people from all over the world, and other then a rare few, my impression of a lot of people? Stereotypical bastards.

  119. The ignorance really goes both ways. It’s damn near impossible to find any article on the internet concerning Newfoundland that isn’t chalked full of prejudice and sweeping generalizations.

    I think that some newfoundlanders don’t trust mainlanders because they’ve been shit on by them for so many years. There are many outspoken mainlanders with patronizing attitudes who genuinely believe that Newfoundlanders are inferior people; no doubt these people are a minority, but the insecure Newfoundlanders who feel they have to retaliate against the mainlanders are also a minority. It’s a self perpetuating problem. But it’s a problem that belongs to the simple minded on both ends of the debate.

    As many have stated in this thread: there are good and bad, smart and foolish, warm and cold people everywhere. If someone decides that 500 000 Newfoundlanders are unfreindly, they’re the shittiest kind of person and you shouldn’t feel obliged to change their way of thinking.

    As for the clique thing, I can see where you’re coming from. But there is merit to sticking with your tight compadres. Making friends all the time means losing friends all the time (that or juggling thousands of friends). Wouldn’t it be better to work at it for a while and find some loyal friends? I’ll party with anyone for a while, but I like having a sitcom style closed off group. You have to be pretty cool if you’re going to work your way into one of those type situations. If that makes me cold then I really don’t give a shit. I’m not going to start making friends with randoms unless I think they’re hilarious.

  120. Your reading the popular history written my the smallwood clan. Barely a quarter of the island participated in the vote for confederation, out of that number only half voted to join Canada.
    Then when we got the oil, Ottawa tried to steal the revenue from us.

    As for the rest of ye, No NF is not the friendliest place on earth anymore. Mainly because we got sick of douche mainlanders coming to the island just looking for the friendliest place on earth while bringing their bullshit snobbly attitudes with them.

    I used to live in a small village in rural NF and had the chance to try and say hello to CFA’s when they came to the B & B in my town. Always Always Always found them to be rude and snobby. We would say hello and they would just look at us like we had three heads.

    No wonder the Nflanders cant stand ye’s.

  121. I say look them up. Many have done so and renew old ties / establish new ones. Any effort at reaching out to others – wherever they may be and whatever their culture – is most likely to be met with kindness and a genuine sense of curiosity.

    Having lived in NY, though, please don’t expect to find NY here. You will find big business, but mostly small, close-knit business clusters; you will find open spaces, coastline and walking trails. We do not drive on a grid system (for which I personally am thankful), but rather navigate by street names and landmarks. Our weather is much the same, but likely a bit cooler on average in the summer. In short, we are different – not better, nor worse than anyone else. That’s as it should be and is no matter where you go or who you meet.

    If you don’t try, though, you’ll never know. Take that step and start a new adventure, but do so with an open mind and with some research beforehand. You won’t be disappointed!

  122. I agree 100% with you, I live from across the boat and finally gotten to live in central newfoundland for 2 years. After having a job and meeting a few people no one wanted to do things over the weekend, I talked with the small few newfoundlanders who told me many people are cliquish. Luckily after working for a whole year I blended in and realized they would jump at the opportunity to speak their accent which they rarely do and make fun of “Da Mainlander”. My father is a big bar lover and thought it would be a great experience to go to a bar, While there he could not get anyone to talk to him I noticed this all with him, even simple kind gestures did not work, he now tells his friends how bad it was and quiet. I felt inferior and tried to become friends. Newfoundlanders have a strong heritage, however they shouldn’t need to make their province become a frat house, “You need to kiss a cod before people can respect you.”, “Did he get screeched in? No? Pshh.. mainlander”.

  123. Sadly, I have to agree with your statement. My family is from Newfoundland, but I was raised on the ‘mainland’. I have lived all over Canada and the US. I have never had any problems meeting friends wherever I lived. I have been friendly and open to people here and have had a few local people do the same. Mostly I have experienced locals (from around the bay)to be rude and unaccepting. As soon as I started my job I had co-workers that are locals call me ‘mainlander’ and make comments about me taking a job from a Newfoundlander and who did I think I was. I would never consider calling them a ‘newfie’ or saying “who do you think you are taking a job from an Ontarian/Manitobian/Albertian” when I lived there. When I asked them to please not refer to me as mainlander and call me by my name please, they would laugh and say they were “just kidding”. They started being really friendly to me and I trusted them, then they ganged up and went behind my back and tried to get me fired by making up a story that wasn’t true and tried to defame my character. Thankfully, my boss and a few stable co-workers knew what they were doing. I was hired from outside because of my qualifications and they have had problems with some of these people refusing to do their jobs. They would run to the union everytime they were repriminded for refusing to work. The union is protecting and encouraging this behaviour. I’ve always been pro union, but not for employees to refuse work for the sake of being lazy. I recently went to a local doctor for a sprain and I broke down in her office from the stress. The Dr. is a Newfoundlander from the west coast and assured me it wasn’t me and that she even experience similar experiences of people being sneaky and sabotaging to her when moving to the Avalon. She has been astonished what locals have done and said to her. I was thinking about quitting my job and moving back to the mainland, but she convinced me that there are good people out there and these assholes want me to quit. I’ve decided I will stay and stand up to all of these ignorant people that are giving Newfoundlanders a bad name. With more Newfoundlanders moving back and other immigrants moving into the province, eventually the considerate and educated people will outnumber the ignorant people and attitudes will hopefully shift. It really would be beneficial to have access to a support group for people moving here. If you have a negative experience, it can be pretty traumatic. If anyone knows of one, please post this info.

  124. There was a CBC radio program on this very topic by a professor from MUN on about a month ago. It was in regards to people moving here to fill the labour shortage and being treated badly. I’ve been trying to find it online. Did anyone hear this and does anyone remember the name of the professor?.

  125. I have only lived in St. John’s so my comments are exclusive to this small portion of Newfoundland. I don’t go out to bars or other social places to meet people, so I likewise can’t speak to this aspect of this city. My experiences are limited but revealing. In this past year, regardless of which part of the city, which time of night, I have suffered the indignity of being hit n run verbally assaulted by locals in their cars as they drive by. I am normal looking, tall, I dress well, or in winter must appear as nothing but a big winter coat and hood, so I know this can’t be anything personal towards me and must be happening to others. I have lived in many parts of Canada, but only in this city have I experienced this behaviour from people. Logically I tell myself that this is the behaviour of some teenagers, likely drunk or high, cruising around looking for laughs by yelling “FUCK YOU” at a random pedestrian, or laughing at them as they walk outside in the freezing rain while honking vigorously. Why is this behaviour not prevalent anywhere else in Canada I’ve lived? Why here? This behaviour resides in extreme low class breeding. One must remember that Newfoundlanders are the result of taking all the failures/criminals/low lifes of the British Isles, confining them to an inhospitable land with drunkeness, poverty, malnutrition, and allowing them to inbreed for the next 500 years! The result? Yokels driving around in Alberta oil money fueled parent-purchased cars, yelling out their car windows at people walking outside for exercise, fresh air, or to attempt to enjoy this cultural backwater of a city.

  126. I have had the exact same experience as gossoqueen…..I was born and raised in Ontario…or Onterrible as the locals like to call it….I spent almost every summer here visiting family…..my parents were born and raised here….I have always loved NL and felt a part of it….until I moved here. I have been told on a regular basis that I don’t belong here, to get off our island, been called a half breed if you can imagine because I was born away! I am a very friendly outgoing person and have travelled and lived all over the world, made friends – life long friends every place I have ever been….except here…I have had people befriend me and be sweet as pie and then they find out that I am from Ontario and literally stop speaking to me like we never met…..Newfoundlanders love you if they think your only here for a visit…to spend some of your money and then get out…..I’ve run into the your taking a job from a NLer mentality here too….I ‘ve lived and worked in other countries and never had this experience, if I am the best person for the job it really doesn’t matter where I’m from does it? I grew up away but so proud of my NL roots…then I moved here and was treated like the enemy on a daily basis…NLers feel like it’s fine and dandy to make fun of the way I speak and my expressions, but if I say anything back I’m a terrible mainlander….I have lived here 6 years and found this to be the most brutal lonley place to try and fit in…the only people here that I have been able to make friends with are other mainlanders…who are just as isolated by the locals on a regular basis as I am…yes I agree people can be this way anwhere…however in my experience people like this are the minority…except here in NL…unless of course you lie to them and tell them you were born here and your parents moved away and now your “back home” then suddenly your ok to be friends with….I gave up… why should I have to lie about where I was born to make a friend? Do I really want a friend I have to lie to in order to get them to be open to getting to know me? Why should I have to listen to “friendly” NLers telling me that I have no right to be here, to get off thier island….6 years of being an outcast simply for not being born here….I have always loved NL and now it makes me sad to say but I can’t wait to leave here and never return

  127. I am from Newfoundland, and have lived in other places in Canada, and YES there are better and worse places to be, Newfoundland is one of the not so good places…

  128. I have only one small statement to make:

    9-11,,,,,,,,, GANDER, NEWFOUNDLAND

  129. Wow, really!!

  130. You vacation in Toronto? Wow!

  131. Is this true?

  132. I’m a Newfie and also a townie, and just because I’m from town don’t mean I’m an asshole because I dont start conversations with strangers! Like common girl you think people are gonna put up signs on water street saying “can some tourists be my friend” like no! Go away which ya!

  133. Sadly, Fine Again, I also know this all too well. On a regular basis, for the past seven years, I’ve had idiots yell at me while I’m out walking, some even throw garbage. Once a car slowed to a crawl next to me, and I was pretty shaken because I thought I was about to be assaulted, but instead I was treated to a young girl bellowing “Missus, wit da money ya spent on dat purse ya prolly coulda ad a car!”

    Seriously, it’s called exercise. It’s like that’s a foreign concept here (along with manners).

  134. I have also lived here for seven years and while I agree with a lot of what’s been said here, the cliquishness, the unwelcoming attitude towards mainlanders, there are knuckle dragging idiots in every city and town in the world who drive around and harass people, it’s not a purely Newfoundland thing like people are saying, not by a long shot.

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